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Dollinger, Genora (Johnson) (audio interview #4 of 8)
INTERVIEW DESCRIPTION - This is the fourth of eight interviews conducted with Genora Dollinger in the sunny den of her home. By this time, we had established a warm and friendly relationship. During the interview, her husband, Sol Dollinger, stopped by to greet me during his lunch hour. 9/16/1976
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- SUBJECT BIO - Genora Johnson Dollinger is best known for her role in forming the Women's Emergency Brigade (of the UAW) during the Flint strike, 1936-7. Born to a relatively prominent and affluent family in Flint, Dollinger developed a heightened sense of women's subjugation as a result of her father's treatment of both his wife and daughters. She became interested in socialism through discussions with Carl Johnson, the father of her future husband, auto worker Kermit Johnson. She married Kermit Johnson over her parents objections, and they had two sons, both of whom were later killed in a car accident. Together with her husband and father-in-law, Dolliinger helped to build the Socialist Party (SP) in Flint, which became one of the organizing avenues for the 1936 strike. After the strike began, frustrated with the traditional roles to which she was initially relegated, Dollinger formed the Women's Emergency Brigade, a militant group of women popularized in the documentary, With Babies and Banners. Dollinger remained active in the UAW following the strike. Later, during the war, and after her marriage to Sol Dollinger, she went to work in Detroit at Briggs Manufacturing. She was badly beaten later, in the postwar years, during the vicious anti-union campaign organized by the manufacturers. While still in Michigan, she became active in the Socialist Workers Party (SWP), worked for the ACLU, and continued to be involved in the UAW. The Dollingers moved to Los Angeles in 1967, when her third son was fourteen years old. Despite her growing health problems, she remained active in a host of liberal and progressive causes and heaped to form the Community Advisory Councils of the LA Unified School District. In 1977, on the occasion of the 40th anniversary of the Flint strike, Dollinger returned to Michigan and, despite her health problems, led a protest against the slighting of women's role in the strike. After her death in 1995, Sol Dollinger published their jointly authored book, Not Automatic: Women and the Left in the Forging of the Auto Workers Union (Monthly Review Press, 2000), which includes an oral history of Genora by Susan Rosenthal. TOPICS - factionalism in UAW and the SP; Martin faction; post-strike speaking tour; Labor Day demonstration in Union Square; Women's Auxiliary conference in Detroit; Jay Lovestone; Kermit Johnson; post-strike structure of Local 156; post-strike labor demonstration; Roy Reuther; factionalism and formation of Clarityite faction; literary influences in Flint SP; and focus and structure of Flint SP during formative years;Clarity faction; views of SP following sit-down strike; Frank Traeger; Roy Reuther; recruitment efforts by SWP; decision to join SWP; SWP organizer Sol Dollinger; development of WPA Local 12; organizing for Local 12; stewardship system in Local 12; relationship between Local 12 and Worker's Alliance; and SWP recruitment while organizing Local 12;Worker's Alliance and organizing WPA workers and the unemployed; CP role in Worker's Alliance; relationship UAW and WPA Locals; Local 12 demonstrations and strikes, April to July 1939; evictions; death watch encampment; structure and operation of Local 12; Local 12 anti-war stance; and attending conference for UAW-WPA locals;UAW national conference for WPA locals; sit-down demonstration at Flint Welfare Department, February 1940; factional disputes in Local 12 and expulsion of Dollinger and militant officers; red-baiting; SWP activities and recruitment efforts; anti-war sentiment in Local 12 and SWP; Kermit Johnson organizing efforts on behalf of Local 12; marital problems; meeting second husband, Sol Dollinger and their courtship; and enrolling in WPA training program to learn war production skills;
- *** File: lhgdollinger12.mp3 Audio Segments and Topics: (0:08-2:14)... introduction: there is a discussion of the topics to be covered during the interview and a clarification discussion on the post-strike chronology, including the factional disputes in the UAW that began as early as 1937. (2:14-7:54)... Following the strike in Flint, Dollinger went on a speaking tour on the East Coast, meeting with several unions and discussing the women's role during the Flint strike. As a representative of the SP of America, she also talked about socialism. She wore her red armband and a socialist emblem during the speaking tour. She was on her speaking tour during Labor Day and notes that the socialist contingent in the New York parades was the largest she had ever seen; she was overwhelmed and impressed by the number of people involved in the radical movement in NY. As an aside, Dollinger recalls the time that she spoke labor union activists at Reverend A.J. Muste's, the Fellowship of Reconciliation hall. (7:54-13:47)... When she returned from her speaking tour, Dollinger assumed the vice presidency of the Women's Auxiliary, serving under a woman who (T. Roy), who she had recruited earlier to the SP. When the Detroit auxiliaries organized a conference for all the auxiliaries in the automobile locals for the purposes of electing international officers and establishing an agenda for future activities, the Flint auxiliary was not consulted. When Dollinger arrived at the conference, she discovered that the Detroit auxiliaries were dominated by the CP. From the conference floor, she protested and requested that no permanent committees be set up or elections held without consultation from the other auxiliaries. The Flint contingent walked out of the conference when it became apparent that they would not be given a participatory role in the proceedings. (13:47-14:57)... Homer Martin appointed Eve Stone, a follower of the Lovestonites, as the director of the women's auxiliaries in the CIO. Stone left this post later during the factional split between the Lovestonites and Homer Martin's faction. Despite Dollinger's feelings about most women in the CP, and her view of them as being narrow minded in their political views, she viewed Stone as an impartial leader. (14:57-17:15)... Dollinger notes that during the post-strike period, the factional disputes in the UAW increased, and people in the SP began to see that Homer Martin as an anti-democratic force. While the CP continued its efforts to dominate the UAW, the Lovestonites began serving Martin in a political advisory capacity. Essentially, the progressive elements in the union fell into two camps, the "Martinites" and the "Clarityites," the latter led by Roy Reuther and Thomas Addis. (17:15-20:20)... Following the strike, separate units were formed in Local 156 based on their particular shop, with the heads of each factory division comprising the members of the Executive Board of Local 156. Kermit Johnson was the chairman of the Chevrolet, and according to Dollinger, was probably the strongest leader. While she ws away on her speaking tour, he and Roy Reuther organized the largest labor demonstration in Flint for all of the workers encompassed in Local 156, which included transport workers, department store clerks, Standard Cotton workers and many others. (20:20-23:04)... Dollinger discusses the factional fighting and the formation of a progressive caucus to mobilize against Homer Martin. She believes that Kermit Johnson helped Thomas Addis and others organize the Unity Caucus in opposition to Martin. At the same time, workers at Fisher Body Plant No. 1 organized an anti-SP faction and heated battles took place between these factions in the post-strike period. (23:04-30:26)... Homer Martin's headquarters were located across the street from Fisher Body Plant No. 1 near the headquarters of Thomas Addis and the Clarityites, which was recognized as the legal headquarters of the UAW. Dollinger maintains that Martin's forces included a host of thugs, including people from the Black Legion, charging that he appealed to anti-union, red-baiting reactionaries. Dollinger describes the attack by Martinites on headquarters in 1939. The police did not intervene, except to block the entrance to their headquarters, and they arrested Clarityites. Dollinger threw a bucket of hot water and lye out the window, deterring people from getting into the headquarters and prompted the authorities to breaking up the crowd. Although not always erupting in physical contact, disputes occurred between the political caucuses in the union at every meeting. (30:26-34:00)... Although Dollinger was not an official member of the UAW, but she was widely known for her efforts during the strike and permitted to attend union meetings, one of the few women in the post-strike period who continued to go to meetings and maintain an interest in UAW developments. After her post-strike hospitalization, before her involvement with the WPA, she spent her time attending SP meetings, and at the union, writing leaflets and being involved in its daily business. (34:00-35:44)... Although Dollinger and her husband, Kermit Johnson, continued to consult on political and ideological matters during the post-strike period, their marriage was strained. She attributes this both to his drinking and to his male pride, which seemed to make it difficult for him to accept the recognition she received. She was determined to save their marriage, but she was not willing to curtail her activities. (35:44-38:50)... When Dollinger organized the SP in Flint with Carl and Kermit Johnson, they either were unaware or not concerned about the factionalism rife in the party at that time. Their focus during those formative years was learning about socialism and the labor movement and educating the work force. It was not until her group began calling themselves Clarityites that some of their efforts turned towards coping with the internal factional disputes within the SP. (38:50-42:14)... Although Dollinger was unaware of the Trotskyites when they entered the SP, she believes the Clarityite faction was organized around the same time in an attempt to bring unity between the old guard socialists and the new. The speeches of the old guard that she heard at a convention, namely by David Dubinsky, neither influenced her own political ideology nor distracted her from her goal of educating workers in Flint. Generally, the socialists in the "Clarity group" were "provincial" and viewed the intellectual socialists as hair-splitters and eastern Bohemians. Those likely to join the clarity faction included Norman Thomas, although he also was more of an intellectual than an organizer and not concerned with bringing clarity to the SP. End of tape. *** File: lhgdollinger13.mp3 (0:00-2:46)... The clarity faction catered to socialists in Michigan who were interested in the labor movement, and their split with other SP groups was more about differences in strategy than ideology. The original purpose for their formation was to bring "clarity" to the differences between Trotskyites and Thomasites. The ultimate goal was the formation of a labor party. During the sit-down strike, there were no factional disputes within the clarity faction in Michigan. (2:46-5:43)... Dollinger's political ideologies were affected by events that transpired during the sit-down strike in Flint. For instance, when the Flint contingent of the SP rejected Kermit Johnson's plan for a sit-down in Chevrolet Plant No. 4, Dollinger appealed to Norman Thomas. In turn, he forwarded her letter to the labor point person in the SP (Frank Traeger?), who did not sense the needs of the working class. Dollinger feels that this was typical of the leaders of the Clarity faction, which made her prefer leaders like Roy Reuther who would have focused on educating the working class. (5:43-10:45)... By the time Dollinger was admitted to a tuberculosis sanitarium in the post-strike period, she had reservations about the SP, which opened her up to the ideas in the Trotskyite literature she received. Although initially had no intention of joining the SWP, after she was released from the sanitarium, she was contacted by George Clark who actively began recruiting her for the SWP. Ultimately, he asked her to meet with Minneapolis truck driver labor leader, Vincent Dunne. From Dunne she learned about the SWP focus on educating workers as well as the important role women played during the truck drivers strike. (10:45-16:29)... Following a meeting with Vincent Dunne, Dollinger and Kermit Johnson traveled to Minneapolis to meet with workers and learn more about SWP functions. She was impressed with the workers she met because they were not as isolated as people in Flint and were better educated about the labor movement. Also, Dollinger believed that in contrast to the SP people were treated equally regardless of their status in the party. When she and Kermit returned to Flint, they joined the SWP, feeling that it suited their goals better. Dollinger comments that the SWP recruited her and Kermit because they believed their popularity would result in more recruits from SP contingents around the country. This tactic failed, however, because she and Kermit were not given the opportunity to dispel the negative connotations that many people held towards Trotskyites. (16:29-20:25)... Dollinger and Kermit Johnson formed the nucleus of the SWP in Flint, and Saul Dollinger, who later became her second husband, was sent from New York to help them with recruitment. Initially, they simply had discussions with people and did not actively recruit until after they began organizing for the WPA local in 1939, by which time there were ten to twelve members in the Flint SWP. (20:25-23:50)... Dollinger tries to provide some chronological clarifications, both about the formation of the Michigan Commonwealth Federation and Kermit Johnson's organizing for the WPA union. Initially, the Worker's Alliance set up programs for WPA workers, but the UAW-CIO decided to establish a WPA local in the union. After Kermit was laid off, they went on public relief for a short period until he was hired on a WPA project. (23:50-25:34)... Once the WPA local was established by the UAW, the union continued to represent the same group of auto workers that had filled its ranks following the sit-down strike. The UAW charged each member .25 cents/month to operate the union hall but was not thrilled about supporting the unemployed because they did not have to pay union dues. However, Dollinger and the SWP felt that the problems of the unemployed, factory workers, and WPA workers were interrelated and organizing them was a distinct UAW role in Flint. The Worker's Alliance also organized the unemployed and the WPA workers in the city, but their efforts were not coordinated with the UAW's. (25:34-30:43)... The drive for creating a WPA local in the UAW derived from the ranks. People were constantly meeting within their political groups or in social settings to discuss unionism. It was in this setting that she and Kermit Johnson recruited people into their party as well as the WPA local. Kermit also recruited people while working on WPA projects. (30:43-33:30)... A stewardship system was organized in the WPA local, with a steward assigned to each WPA job site. A large number of WPA workers could not afford to pay union dues and did not join the WPA local, but whenever the union organized a strike at a WPA work project, they participated. Dollinger comments that although there were never any scabs, there were suspicious individuals, including at least one man who was later instrumental in orchestrating her expulsion from ? [Editor's note; the interviewer did not clarify if this was an expulsion from the WPA local]. (33:30-37:28)... The militant members of the WPA local pressured the UAW to represent the unemployed in Flint as well as WPA workers. Dollinger was not aware what WPA locals were doing in other cities, but recalls that when a local leader from Detroit visited Flint he mentioned that the local was too militant. Dollinger and the other militant members believed that there could be no separation between the unemployed and the WPA workers; even when a man had a job, he had relatives and friends who were unemployed. The auto workers in the factories supported the local and often contributed money to the leaflet fund and attended the local's dances on Saturday evenings. (37:28-40:26)... When the WPA local (Local 12) was formed, Dollinger was elected recording secretary; the other early officers included Pat Murray and Claude Workman. Roy Lawrence, who assumed an official position later, initially joined helped organize WPA workers who lived in his town of Mt. Morris, most of whom had worked in Flint at Buick or AC Spark Plug. Dollinger and Kermit Johnson organized people for Local 12 and recruited for the SWP. Since there was no time for political discussions, they merely signed people up and gave them issues of the Militant. Dollinger note that the people who joined the SWP during this period had difficulty with the term "Trotskyite" and preferred calling themselves socialists in the SWP. (40:26-43:00)... Initially, Local 12 tried to organize demonstrations jointly with the Worker's Alliance. Dollinger note, however, that the Worker's Alliance viewed Local 12 as a rival and thought that any unification between the two groups would result in their losing members. When WPA organizers went to job sites, they had more clout than the Worker's Alliance because of their affiliation with the UAW-CIO. Generally, Local 12 tried to avoid factional disputes with the Worker's Alliance and avoided mentioning it in their leaflets. Occasionally, local organizers in their speeches might mention the inability of the Worker's Alliance to achieve certain goals for workers. End of tape. *** File: lhgdollinger14.mp3 (0:02-1:07)... It was important for the WPA Local 12 to publish leaflets every week in order to compete with the literature being put out by the Worker's Alliance. Although there were several members of the CP who aligned themselves with the Worker's Alliance, she states, "it was a strange thing. There was a tremendous amount of respect for what the WPA and the unemployed in Local 12 were doing." (1:07-2:28)... There was very little communication between the WPA locals and, according to Dollinger, the two conferences held in Detroit for the locals didn't provide much direction. Local 12 also received very little, if any, guidance from the UAW-CIO international headquarters, which allowed them to operate autonomously. (2:28-6:13)... In April 1939, a demonstration of WPA workers was organized to protest wages and the termination of WPA workers. They began their march at the UAW-CIO headquarters and made their way to the city hall, where a mass meeting was held with speeches by Kermit Johnson, Claude Workman, C. Walters and others. Most of the demonstrators were men who worked on outdoor projects; generally the women worked on professional jobs or in sewing projects and seemed content with their jobs and conditions. (6:13-8:22)... Initially, the demonstrators involved in the march on city hall comprised mainly WPA workers, but Local 12 organizers encouraged the unemployed workers in the city to get involved. Additionally, auto workers still employed in the factories participated in the demonstrations if and when they had a day off. For the most part, very few SP members were involved in this effort; however, they sympathized with the local. (8:22-13:03)... Note: there is an interruption in this segment when the tape is briefly turned off. Local 12 organized what became known as the "death watch" in response to the evictions of the unemployed following the cancellation of their rent allowances. Families were separated after they were evicted. with the women and children sent to one shelter and men to another. One of the initial protest actions of Local 12 was sending crews of people to eviction sites in order to place the furniture of those who were evicted back into their homes and stand guard over the location. Because this became too cumbersome to manage and several fights broke out, the Local eventually established an encampment at a park on Industrial Avenue across the street from the welfare department and a Buick factory. They acquired army tents to house the evicted families at the encampment. (13:03-14:40)... Local 12 changed locations twice after its formation. During the "death watch," they were located in an old building on Industrial Avenue. Chairs and a table were donated by the UAW and that was the only furniture in the office. Dollinger did all of her leaflet typing from her apartment. (14:40-18:16)... There were only three or four families who occupied the tents at the encampment during the "death watch." The Local only had two army tents and a small camping tent, but most families were not willing to stay in the camp. Daunted by the lack of privacy, they also were ashamed to advertise the fact that they were on relief. Dollinger describes the camp facilities and how the families living there managed. Local 12 set up signs with rather dramatic slogans on both corners flanking the welfare department and the Buick plant. (18:16-19:50)... Local 12 representatives visited eviction sites and shelters seeking families willing to stay in the encampment during the death watch. One family came from a coal mining background and the woman "felt it was her duty to get out there and her husband's." She was conscientious about maintaining a regular presence outside so that people could see her carry on with her daily life, which included nursing a baby and caring for her other children. Dollinger was more familiar with the women in these families because they were the one there more; the men were at demonstrations and picket lines. (19:50-23:49)... Although the city issued warnings to the UAW regarding the encampment, no measures were taken to remove the families in the park. The Local tapped into the city's power lines to get electricity inside and outside the tents, and to illuminate one of the signs at the corner of Industrial Avenue. Dollinger believes that the city didn't move against them because the vast majority of people in Flint sympathized with the families. Local 12 issued statements and leaflets asking for volunteers to guard the park to ensure the families' safety. Men patrolled the park on a twenty-four hour basis. A demonstration was held at one end of the park on the first day of the death watch, but did not continue after that because it would have been difficult to maintain a steady protest action. (23:49-25:00)... The park encampment generated a great deal of curiosity both in and outside Flint. Although most people were of working-class backgrounds and sympathetic to the families, there also were reactionaries and anti-union voices that expressed dismay and complained about the free use of the city's power. Local 12 made no attempts to move more families into the park because of the difficulty they faced in acquiring shelter. (25:00-26:04)... Food was donated to the families in the park encampment and women often prepared hot meals and took them there. Workers and the unemployed people in the city saw to it that these families were cared for, and the workers at the Buick plant across the street from the encampment checked on them. (26:04-28:07)... There was virtually no reaction from the welfare department to the death watch. Whenever Local 12 officers tried to negotiate with welfare officials, they usually responded that their hands were tied. At some point, a request was made to Washington, DC to release commodity surpluses to aid the people of Flint, but they were told that there was nothing left. (28:07-30:21)... The death watch was initiated in reaction to the 900 families who were evicted and/or cut off from public relief. Dollinger recalls that a group of truck drivers volunteered to transport the furniture of one family to the park after they were evicted. Most of the workers in the city, regardless where they worked, supported the families and were willing to help the Local in any way possible. There were very few AFL workers, however, who were involved in these efforts or supported mass production workers during this period. (30:21-36:40)... Dollinger notes that during the death watch, there was a flurry of activity and the Local was constantly considering various action proposals and holding regular meetings to discuss them. The Executive Board consulted on emergency actions whenever a Local meeting could not be organized, but generally members were kept abreast of developments through leaflets and/or steward reports. The main contact with the unemployed took place at relief headquarters where Local 12 representatives maintained a daily presence. WPA workers, the unemployed, and factory workers stood by each other during what Dollinger describes as "a period of great homogeneity in the city.... " - a lesson learned from the strike. She notes that a grievance committee was established in Local 12 to resolve issues for workers on WPA projects. (36:40-38:29)... The death watch ended when a resolution was reached that stipulated a moratorium on evictions and the closure of the shelters. Housing was arranged for the displaced families and people mobilized to help them move. This was a big victory for Local 12 and boosted the morale of the working-class of Flint. (38:29-43:03)... WPA workers in Flint organized a one day strike on July 11, 1939 to protest proposed cut backs in WPA projects. Kermit Johnson digging ditches on a WPA project and learned that foremen on certain job sites were threatening to terminate workers if they participated in the strike. He went to those sites, along with Pat Murray and Claude Workmen, and pulled the workers out. Johnson and Workmen were recognized as leaders of the strike. When Wayne Adams of the Worker's Alliance spoke during the strike, he was reluctant to associate with Local 12, and praised FDR. Local 12, on the other hand, previously criticized FDR noting the connection between his war budget and cutbacks in relief programs. (43:03-44:46)... Following the July 1939 strike of WPA workers, Local 12 concentrated its efforts on proposals for an independent labor party and anti-war resolutions. This was a period during which Dollinger was criticized by local leaders. There were few strikes or demonstrations during this time. Instead, the Local continued its normal course of business negotiating resolutions, distributing leaflets and handling grievances with WPA foremen. Although the Local was concerned about war appropriations, their focus turned towards permanent jobs for workers. (44:46-46:37)... In discussing the UAW conference organized for WPA Locals, Dollinger could not recall much about the women who attended. There was no relationship between SWP representatives and the organizers of this conference. A few socialists attended the conference, including an official from the Steelworkers Organizing Committee. End of tape. *** File: lhgdollinger15.mp3 (0:00-2:16)... In continuing discussion of the UAW conference organized for WPA Locals, Dollinger does not recall anything about the proposal that women occupy positions on the National Organizing Committee in a consultative capacity, and doubts that she is the one who introduced it. She recalls little of the conference; her main focus at this time was agitating that funds go towards jobs rather than retooling automobile factories for war production. (2:16-7:27)... In February 1940, WPA Local 12 organized a sit-in demonstration at the Welfare Department. During a meeting with the administrator, crowds gathered outside the building and burned an effigy of the administrator. Demonstrators filed into the welfare building and initiated the sit down, which lasted until the next morning. The police were present, but cooperated with demonstrators and even contributed to their food fund. The following afternoon, the administrator announced that surplus commodities would be resumed in Flint and distributed to the public once they arrived. This was another big victory for the unemployed. Dollinger notes that it was very important to claim victories in order to boost the morale of the unemployed. (7:27-9:06)... The goal of the sit-down demonstration at the welfare building was to get relief resources distributed and to have Local 12 recognized. Part of the resolution stipulated that the administrator was required to hold regularly scheduled meetings with representatives of Local 12. The Local provided an agenda of demands at each meeting and discussed problems on WPA job sites with him. Although he listened to their demands and tried to resolve these issues, results were slow because of government red tape. However, it was an important milestone for the unemployed and WPA workers to have a representative from the welfare department addressing their concerns. (9:06-16:33)... In March 1940, the factional dispute between the militant and conservative wings of the Local escalated. Joe Pagano, a representative of the UAW-CIO in Detroit, stepped in to quell the militancy of the Local. He canceled the Local's charter and removed Dollinger and the militant officers after she released an inflammatory cartoon juxtaposing war appropriations and the plight of the public worker. When the membership vehemently protested his actions during a Local meeting, he reinstated the charter and the militants. (16:33-19:26)... In the 1940s, Dollinger went to work for the WPA on professional projects, beginning with an assignment to the timekeeping section of a library project. She also worked on recreational projects and in the city's water department. When the Flint News Advertiser published a story with the headline, "Flint's Leading Red in Position to Blow Up Water Supply in the City," city administrators demanded that she be fired. The woman in the WPA Professional Services Division who hired Dollinger (India Myers) was a socialist and the mother of one of her childhood sweethearts. Myers refused to comply and instead transferred the entire WPA project out of the water department. (19:26-23:05)... Dollinger did not have any difficulty coordinating her work on WPA projects with her responsibilities in Local 12. By the time she went to work for the WPA, projects were winding down for the men, and women were mainly concentrated in the professional projects and not very active in the union. As the number of projects declined, the WPA introduced training programs to prepare people for war production work. At this time, she became more immersed in the internal disputes in the UAW, and more active in the SWP and in anti-war discussions. When she refused to contribute to FDR's campaign fund along with her WPA co-workers, the heads of the WPA programs in Flint once again requested her dismissal. India Myers, however, refused to release her on that basis. (23:05-24:48)... Dollinger went to work for the WPA to enable her husband, Kermit Johnson, to dedicate his time organizing workers on WPA project sites for Local 12. She and Kermit also were having financial difficulties and she stood to make more money on a professional project than he would make on an outdoor project. She notes that this wasn't very easy for him to accept. (24:48-30:02)... In addition to their work in Local 12, Dollinger and Kermit Johnson were actively recruiting people into the SWP. They were unable to spend a great deal of time educating their recruits except for talking to them about their philosophies and the need to change the whole system. Even though people were going back to work in factories and producing war products, they did not criticize the SWP's or Local 12's anti-war views. Most factory workers believed that the war products they produced were meant for the allies or to build up an arsenal for US preparedness. Like FDR, they did not want to get involved in another foreign war. Anti-war resolutions were also being considered in the Michigan CIO Council. As Local 12's activities decreased, Dollinger's main focus shifted to the war and accepting a leadership role in the SWP. One of their challenges during this period was defending against reactionaries like Father Charles E. Coughlin. (30:02-33:49)... When WPA projects decreased and there was a return to full employment, Kermit Johnson left his organizing position in Local 12 and went back to work for Chevrolet. A short time later, he moved to Detroit to work in a factory for six months. When he came home on the weekends, he was agitated and uninterested in spending time with his family, which made her suspicious. She traveled to Detroit one afternoon and discovered that he was having an affair and living with his mistress. After she confronted him, he convinced her that he made a mistake and they reconciled for a short period. When their reconciliation failed, she took a leave of absence from her WPA project and went to New York to give him time to think about how he wanted to proceed with their marriage. While there, she met her future second husband, Sol Dollinger. [Note: previously she referred to Sol Dollinger coming to Flint to help her and Kermit organize the SWP.] (33:36-38:43)... She describes how she met her future second husband, Sol Dollinger, in New York while he was on leave from the Merchant Marine. [Note: previously she referred to Sol Dollinger coming to Flint to help her and Kermit organize the SWP.] When Dollinger's sister with whom she was staying left New York, Sol arranged for Dollinger to stay with some friends. Unbeknownst to her, he learned that she had received word from Kermit Johnson that he was not interested in continuing their marriage. Sol asked her to marry him ten days later. Initially she tried to discourage him, but after he persisted, she decided to pursue a relationship with him. After attending an SWP conference in Chicago, they returned to Flint. To avoid the draft, he went on another tour with the Merchant Marine and was shipped out a short time later. The ship he was on was attacked and sunk., and although she believed he was dead, he was injured during the attack and received treatment in a Russian hospital before returning to Flint. (38:43-39:58)... While Sol Dollinger was on his Merchant Marine tour, she left her job with the WPA and enrolled in a WPA training program in preparation for a job in defense. She was supporting her children on her own and thought that working in war production would be more lucrative than her WPA work. An ulterior motive for going into defense work was to organize workers for the union and the SWP. After Sol returned to Flint in 1942, they moved to Detroit and she went to work in a defense plant. (39:58-40:40)... Dollinger notes that she, Kermit Johnson, and Saul Dollinger worked together in organizing the Flint chapter of the SWP after she and Saul returned to Flint the second time. [Note: her chronology is confused here. Previously she referred to Sol Dollinger coming to Flint to help her and Kermit organize the SWP, which was considerably earlier.] (40:40-42:29)... Dollinger could not recall much about the WPA defense work training program, except that the number of women in the program was disproportionate to the number of men. She did well in the course, scoring high marks for her skills in instrumentation and blueprint-reading. End of tape.
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